In what universe do you bomb a country and then ask for the same peace accord that you tore up four years ago?
This is not a rhetorical question. This is some serious shit. It really cuts to the heart of hypocrisy and the tangled nature of international relations...it’s a world according to Trump. Bombing a country, causing widespread destruction and terror and then asking for peace is an obvious double standard. Especially if you’re asking for terms that were already agreed upon and then disregarded years ago because of political jealousy. That’s the kind of situation that breeds distrust and resentment—it’s not just about the actions themselves but the implications of broken promises, aggressive policies, intimidation and retribution.
Ironies abound, don't they? And thanks to Jennifer for reminding us of the greatest one of all. It was President Obama who authorized development of the current 30,000 pound bunker-buster bomb, apparently used to destroy the underground complex at Fordo tonight as a kind of trump card (pun intended) in his back pocket even with the 5-country JCPOA agreement -- the same one Trump trashed during his first time around.
I'm such a good psychic I can even predict that in tonight's garbled mess of red-hatted ersatz patriotic slop soon to gush out of Trump's facial orifice in a few minutes, no mention will be made of any of that...
I think the larger point was about adhering to the principle of 'speak softly, but carry a big stick' as opposed to 'swagger, primp, preen and maybe lie about what your big stick just did.'
Add to that the fact that Trump is simultaneously carrying out a trade war with every country we used to call allies. The chances that ANY of them will rush to form a coalition with us is a fever dream. They know this administration is an unreliable, untrustworthy partner. Trump's idiocy in foreign affairs has guaranteed we're on our own in this war on Iran.
As the other comment here says, 'ironies abound'..
Like the irony of Jennifer Rubin criticizing a war in Iran after her many years of harshly criticizing Obama for negotiating a nuclear agreement with Iran.
This was Jennifer Rubin in 2010:
'I am not alone in concluding that the Obami are fundamentally unserious about preventing the mullahs from acquiring nuclear weapons....the Obami have thrown cold water on the notion that a military strike might be in the offing....Among the Obami’s many ill-advised foreign-policy gambits and misjudgments, none would be so devastating as permitting the revolutionary Islamic regime to acquire nuclear weapons. But that is precisely where we are heading....'
And yes, she used the word 'Obami' in a very Trump like fashion, several times.
More ironies: Jennifer Rubin being against a war with Iran after her many years of steadfast and emphatic support for the Iraq War, even long after the American public was solidly against it.
Even in 2014, she was still saying things like this:
'I’ve been surprised by the lack of effort on the part of those who backed the Iraq War to defend it. They were unusually quiet as the 10th anniversary of the war came and went, as if in a defensive crouch while the “what a disastrous war” crowd had the field.'
If you can find a single link where Rubin apologizes for being so incredibly wrong about the Iraq War, or apologizing for her nonstop criticism of Obama for being to conciliatory and dovish (which is in itself pretty wild), or for using straight up racist, Trump-like language like "The Obami", please post.
I have looked and have never seen this.
Her loud and brash commitment to war and nonstop bashing of Obama helped lay the groundwork among 'sensible' conservatives for Trump's rise.
Rubin may be a Never Trumper now and may provide insightful commentary on many domestic issues, but when it comes to the Middle East, she is still fundamentally the same staunchly pro Israel, anti everyone else neocon she always was.
It's easy to spot - even in very recent posts she will write about Israeli civilian deaths without even mentioning there have been far more Iranian deaths already..not to mention The Contrarian's total blackout on reporting on the ongoing atrocities in the Occupied Territories. In her recent posts about Iran, her focus is always toward the strategy and timing, without ever mentioning the blatant violation of international law(again) by both the US and Israel and its huge toll on Iranian civilians.
I agree with you, Jason. Jen is definitely anti-DJT on issues now, save for Israel. There must be support from groups like Contrarians for the US to change its alliance with Israel. I get why there is a lot of emotional baggage about Israel. But it's time to rethink the nature of our alliance and the degree of our financial and military support for Israel, including our intelligence-sharing. And by the way, the rest of the world needs to do a similar re-think about how the US is given a pass on our own war crimes around the world, and our violations of UN declarations of human rights.
I am sure that there are many here that, like me, were very happy to see Rubin leave the Washington Post after we cancelled our subscriptions in disgust this past fall. She is a great writer and very knowledgeable.
But, like many 'moderates' in the Democratic Party, she still has a big gap between her views on domestic policies and her opinions regarding Israel, the Occupied Territories and the Middle East.
It is quite clear that Israel is the primary instigator of violence in the Middle East. Israelis occupying land in Syria, has violated the ceasefire with Lebanon and has been bombing Yemen, regularly, as well as launching missiles and assassinating officials in Iran whenever it feels like it....not to mention to ongoing horrors in both Gaza and the West Bank. It is incredible that the US not only tolerates but actively supports such belligerence.
For me , this is why Rubin and The Contrarian's lack of criticism toward Israel is so disappointing and dangerous, She is a respected voice among the broader 'left' and has a lot of influence. The more Israel's actions are ignored or normalized or outright supported by liberals, the more they will go on.
As far as how the US is 'given a pass', I hear you, but I am not sure what the world can do (outside those small handful of other colonial countries that by and large support the US and Israel). If the US continuously flouts UN resolutions as you point out, actually sanctions the ICC, and just generally sneers at international law, what then? Any move any country has ever made to counter Israel pays a price. The US is still really powerful.
People grow, people with a moral center change their minds when persuaded. Jen Rubin has shown the moral fiber to buck her fellow conservatives and change. I applaud her for that.
In other words, "I won't even read your response, because I am entirely uninterested in any opinion that may challenge my own."
I guess for some, being a 'Contrarian' means "accepting everything Jennifer Rubin says without question, even when she contradicts other things she said herself."
There is so much that Jen is very right about, that I have to wonder if her knowledge of the history of Palestine and Israel and of their conflict, just doesn't go back far enough for her to see the roots of conflict objectively.
Dennis, your absolutely correct on every point. The felon is out of his league, if he ever had one and will not handle this well. Obama had an agreement and because it was Obama the shit for brains felon threw it away. This is what happens when a fool gets elected. They do foolish things that will get people killed.
Trump has no patience for anything, and is certainly unable and unwilling to go the distance in a negotiations process. Did they really think Iran would not retaliate, a time of their choosing, just as we would?
We have certainly been complicit in our muted responses to the atrocities, continued support for them as well as approval. I am afraid there is more to come.
Netanyahu has been unleashed and emboldened by a bipartisan consensus in the US.
What did anyone think would happen when the US has continued to support Israel's apartheid and genocide at every turn? The US protects this indicted war criminal, sends him billions in military aid, then sanctions the world governing bodies that try to administer justice, while also vetoing USN resolutions against Israel over and over. Of course Bibi and his terrorist allies will take advantage of that.
The joint US/ISraeli 'Gaza Humanitarian Foundation' continues to lure in intentionally starved Palestinians, then murder them in cold blood by the hundreds, now happening practically every day. If the US will condone this disgusting, ongoing atrocity, why would it stop Israel from doing anything else?
You won't find a single word anywhere in The Contrarian about how the ongoing US support for Israel's crimes in the Occupied Territories has directly led to Israel's belligerence in the region. The Contrarian has had a virtual blackout on the ongoing US/Israeli violence against Palestinians, while also largely ignoring Israel's occupation in Syria and its continued bombing in Lebanon and Yemen.
Totally expected that this would happen! Let’s see what the felon does when the American body bags start rolling in and our young servicemen and women come home injured and broken!
And what good will that do us if he suppresses our rights even more? Which I am sure he will do. We are teetering on the edge of some very dangerous times and most of those 77 million were too stupid or too sexist to see it coming.
I don't expect we'll have boots on the ground in Iran, but there's plenty of bases and such to hit. If Israel wants troops to go in there, then they can send their own.
I will say this once: Israel is soley concerned with its security and its long term goals. It views the U.S. as a source of munitions and funds and could careless less about any danger its actions might pose to Americans.
(a) Written report; time of submission; circumstances necessitating submission; information reported
In the absence of a declaration of war, in any case in which United States Armed Forces are introduced—
(1) into hostilities or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances;
(2) into the territory, airspace or waters of a foreign nation, while equipped for combat, except for deployments which relate solely to supply, replacement, repair, or training of such forces; or
(3) in numbers which substantially enlarge United States Armed Forces equipped for combat already located in a foreign nation;
the President shall submit within 48 hours to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and to the President pro tempore of the Senate a report, in writing, setting forth—
(A) the circumstances necessitating the introduction of United States Armed Forces;
(B) the constitutional and legislative authority under which such introduction took place; and
(C) the estimated scope and duration of the hostilities or involvement."
We have now officially blundered our way into Donald Rumsfeld's mysterious world of "unknown unknowns." Like Dark Energy itself, it's a dimension that can't even be described using existing parameters. We have no idea what will happen now.
With a demented moron desperate to remain the center of attention everywhere at all times, cosplaying somebody tough, competent, stable, and intelligent, no matter the cost or consequences, supposedly running things, but barely in charge of his own faculties and at the mercy of all kinds of 'grey cardinals' whispering God knows what in his ear -- even if he listens --- well, good luck with sleeping soundly tonight!
[1] It is a regime that has built proxies, has a terrorist reach across the globe, has the largest missile inventory in the region, started a regional conflict with the help of its proxies on October 7, 2023, and is building a nuclear weapon. I mean, I think that's abundantly clear.
{2] ...will Trump now use even more power to suppress dissent, to crack down on free speech, to deport people, to perhaps suspend or try to suspend habeas corpus. The litany of things that he might try if this becomes an extended war is truly frightful.
In addition to what you all are saying, my concern is that Donnie Two Dolls will cancel the fall elections bc he’s afraid his bootlickers will be voted out of office.
Sleeper cells already likely in place with contingency plans. While Deadeyes Miller and ICE Barbie are bankrupting DHS hunting down students and grandparents, they’re completely unprepared for a 9/11 redux. Fat Donnie just impulsively kicked a hornet’s nest with the full support of his fascist party (and Fetterman). Israel doesn’t have the capacity for a ground war in Iran, which means guess who for the next step? Only a world-class moron believes that he can punch a modern nation of 95 million in the nose a couple of times and walk away unscathed.
Oh, and he still wants his plutocratic tax cuts and draconian social cuts. Absolute shitshow.
There is a Protest Rally planned for June 26th - MoveOn and Public Citizen are sponsoring this one. Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
The next NO KINGS PROTEST RALLY is scheduled for July 4th. Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
There will be a Protest Rally honoring the late great Congressman John Lewis's 5th Anniversary of his death - "Good Trouble" - Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
No plan survives contact with the enemy. No one really knows what's going to happen now. Brace yourselves for much higher gas prices and a tanking stock market to start with.
It doesn't take even one expert to know that this will be a massive clusterf-ck.
In what universe do you bomb a country and then ask for the same peace accord that you tore up four years ago?
This is not a rhetorical question. This is some serious shit. It really cuts to the heart of hypocrisy and the tangled nature of international relations...it’s a world according to Trump. Bombing a country, causing widespread destruction and terror and then asking for peace is an obvious double standard. Especially if you’re asking for terms that were already agreed upon and then disregarded years ago because of political jealousy. That’s the kind of situation that breeds distrust and resentment—it’s not just about the actions themselves but the implications of broken promises, aggressive policies, intimidation and retribution.
Ironies abound, don't they? And thanks to Jennifer for reminding us of the greatest one of all. It was President Obama who authorized development of the current 30,000 pound bunker-buster bomb, apparently used to destroy the underground complex at Fordo tonight as a kind of trump card (pun intended) in his back pocket even with the 5-country JCPOA agreement -- the same one Trump trashed during his first time around.
I'm such a good psychic I can even predict that in tonight's garbled mess of red-hatted ersatz patriotic slop soon to gush out of Trump's facial orifice in a few minutes, no mention will be made of any of that...
Remember though, Obama did not and would not use a bomb as a key to diplomacy.
I think the larger point was about adhering to the principle of 'speak softly, but carry a big stick' as opposed to 'swagger, primp, preen and maybe lie about what your big stick just did.'
Absolutely.
Oh yes. I already read some spin that Iran has been attacking us in the last 2 months!
Add to that the fact that Trump is simultaneously carrying out a trade war with every country we used to call allies. The chances that ANY of them will rush to form a coalition with us is a fever dream. They know this administration is an unreliable, untrustworthy partner. Trump's idiocy in foreign affairs has guaranteed we're on our own in this war on Iran.
As the other comment here says, 'ironies abound'..
Like the irony of Jennifer Rubin criticizing a war in Iran after her many years of harshly criticizing Obama for negotiating a nuclear agreement with Iran.
This was Jennifer Rubin in 2010:
'I am not alone in concluding that the Obami are fundamentally unserious about preventing the mullahs from acquiring nuclear weapons....the Obami have thrown cold water on the notion that a military strike might be in the offing....Among the Obami’s many ill-advised foreign-policy gambits and misjudgments, none would be so devastating as permitting the revolutionary Islamic regime to acquire nuclear weapons. But that is precisely where we are heading....'
And yes, she used the word 'Obami' in a very Trump like fashion, several times.
More ironies: Jennifer Rubin being against a war with Iran after her many years of steadfast and emphatic support for the Iraq War, even long after the American public was solidly against it.
Even in 2014, she was still saying things like this:
'I’ve been surprised by the lack of effort on the part of those who backed the Iraq War to defend it. They were unusually quiet as the 10th anniversary of the war came and went, as if in a defensive crouch while the “what a disastrous war” crowd had the field.'
People change their minds. Everyone does based on events of the day.
If you can find a single link where Rubin apologizes for being so incredibly wrong about the Iraq War, or apologizing for her nonstop criticism of Obama for being to conciliatory and dovish (which is in itself pretty wild), or for using straight up racist, Trump-like language like "The Obami", please post.
I have looked and have never seen this.
Her loud and brash commitment to war and nonstop bashing of Obama helped lay the groundwork among 'sensible' conservatives for Trump's rise.
Rubin may be a Never Trumper now and may provide insightful commentary on many domestic issues, but when it comes to the Middle East, she is still fundamentally the same staunchly pro Israel, anti everyone else neocon she always was.
It's easy to spot - even in very recent posts she will write about Israeli civilian deaths without even mentioning there have been far more Iranian deaths already..not to mention The Contrarian's total blackout on reporting on the ongoing atrocities in the Occupied Territories. In her recent posts about Iran, her focus is always toward the strategy and timing, without ever mentioning the blatant violation of international law(again) by both the US and Israel and its huge toll on Iranian civilians.
I agree with you, Jason. Jen is definitely anti-DJT on issues now, save for Israel. There must be support from groups like Contrarians for the US to change its alliance with Israel. I get why there is a lot of emotional baggage about Israel. But it's time to rethink the nature of our alliance and the degree of our financial and military support for Israel, including our intelligence-sharing. And by the way, the rest of the world needs to do a similar re-think about how the US is given a pass on our own war crimes around the world, and our violations of UN declarations of human rights.
Agreed.
I am sure that there are many here that, like me, were very happy to see Rubin leave the Washington Post after we cancelled our subscriptions in disgust this past fall. She is a great writer and very knowledgeable.
But, like many 'moderates' in the Democratic Party, she still has a big gap between her views on domestic policies and her opinions regarding Israel, the Occupied Territories and the Middle East.
It is quite clear that Israel is the primary instigator of violence in the Middle East. Israelis occupying land in Syria, has violated the ceasefire with Lebanon and has been bombing Yemen, regularly, as well as launching missiles and assassinating officials in Iran whenever it feels like it....not to mention to ongoing horrors in both Gaza and the West Bank. It is incredible that the US not only tolerates but actively supports such belligerence.
For me , this is why Rubin and The Contrarian's lack of criticism toward Israel is so disappointing and dangerous, She is a respected voice among the broader 'left' and has a lot of influence. The more Israel's actions are ignored or normalized or outright supported by liberals, the more they will go on.
As far as how the US is 'given a pass', I hear you, but I am not sure what the world can do (outside those small handful of other colonial countries that by and large support the US and Israel). If the US continuously flouts UN resolutions as you point out, actually sanctions the ICC, and just generally sneers at international law, what then? Any move any country has ever made to counter Israel pays a price. The US is still really powerful.
People grow, people with a moral center change their minds when persuaded. Jen Rubin has shown the moral fiber to buck her fellow conservatives and change. I applaud her for that.
see my comment above.
No need. You're clearly not interested in anyone's opinion but your own.
That is hilarious.
In other words, "I won't even read your response, because I am entirely uninterested in any opinion that may challenge my own."
I guess for some, being a 'Contrarian' means "accepting everything Jennifer Rubin says without question, even when she contradicts other things she said herself."
Feel better now, hon?
There is so much that Jen is very right about, that I have to wonder if her knowledge of the history of Palestine and Israel and of their conflict, just doesn't go back far enough for her to see the roots of conflict objectively.
Dennis, your absolutely correct on every point. The felon is out of his league, if he ever had one and will not handle this well. Obama had an agreement and because it was Obama the shit for brains felon threw it away. This is what happens when a fool gets elected. They do foolish things that will get people killed.
Trump has no patience for anything, and is certainly unable and unwilling to go the distance in a negotiations process. Did they really think Iran would not retaliate, a time of their choosing, just as we would?
Pray for our troops!
And for humanity
The “troops” are also attacking Americans in American cities
Netanyahu deserves no help. He is a war criminal.
they are all war criminals.
Including ourselves, our country.
We have certainly been complicit in our muted responses to the atrocities, continued support for them as well as approval. I am afraid there is more to come.
Agreed!
Netanyahu has been unleashed and emboldened by a bipartisan consensus in the US.
What did anyone think would happen when the US has continued to support Israel's apartheid and genocide at every turn? The US protects this indicted war criminal, sends him billions in military aid, then sanctions the world governing bodies that try to administer justice, while also vetoing USN resolutions against Israel over and over. Of course Bibi and his terrorist allies will take advantage of that.
The joint US/ISraeli 'Gaza Humanitarian Foundation' continues to lure in intentionally starved Palestinians, then murder them in cold blood by the hundreds, now happening practically every day. If the US will condone this disgusting, ongoing atrocity, why would it stop Israel from doing anything else?
You won't find a single word anywhere in The Contrarian about how the ongoing US support for Israel's crimes in the Occupied Territories has directly led to Israel's belligerence in the region. The Contrarian has had a virtual blackout on the ongoing US/Israeli violence against Palestinians, while also largely ignoring Israel's occupation in Syria and its continued bombing in Lebanon and Yemen.
Totally expected that this would happen! Let’s see what the felon does when the American body bags start rolling in and our young servicemen and women come home injured and broken!
Do you really think that sob cares about young Americans coming back in body bags?
No, but it will be on him and the 77 million that voted this warmonger into office
And what good will that do us if he suppresses our rights even more? Which I am sure he will do. We are teetering on the edge of some very dangerous times and most of those 77 million were too stupid or too sexist to see it coming.
Stupid, sexist, racist . . . I'd like to put the lot of them in detention until they've read the Constitution.
So much for his covetted Nobel Peace Prize.
I don't expect we'll have boots on the ground in Iran, but there's plenty of bases and such to hit. If Israel wants troops to go in there, then they can send their own.
I will say this once: Israel is soley concerned with its security and its long term goals. It views the U.S. as a source of munitions and funds and could careless less about any danger its actions might pose to Americans.
JMHO
. . . or to the rest of the world.
They do.
He’ll be playing golf instead of facing the families of the fallen. The “Suckers” HE sent into war. I want to cry.
I want to scream 🙀
It will not be reported. Military bases will be sealed off from journalists. Injured troops and their families will be silenced.
Play golf
When we unilaterally bomb a country that has not to my knowledge attacked the U.S., The felon has essentially instigated a war with that country!
Hmmm. Where have we seen that before?
Jasmine Crockett has posted on Substack :
"Here is yet another reminder that the Constitution is not optional…
Congress must authorize military force before any president—including Trump—launches a strike."
Sounds to me like Congress did not.
"Jasmine Crockett has posted on Substack"
From the War Powers Resolution of 1973:
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title50/chapter33&edition=prelim
"§1543. Reporting requirement
(a) Written report; time of submission; circumstances necessitating submission; information reported
In the absence of a declaration of war, in any case in which United States Armed Forces are introduced—
(1) into hostilities or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances;
(2) into the territory, airspace or waters of a foreign nation, while equipped for combat, except for deployments which relate solely to supply, replacement, repair, or training of such forces; or
(3) in numbers which substantially enlarge United States Armed Forces equipped for combat already located in a foreign nation;
the President shall submit within 48 hours to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and to the President pro tempore of the Senate a report, in writing, setting forth—
(A) the circumstances necessitating the introduction of United States Armed Forces;
(B) the constitutional and legislative authority under which such introduction took place; and
(C) the estimated scope and duration of the hostilities or involvement."
Thank you for outlining this with Congresswoman Crockett's information..
Even Representative Massie said Congress must act to authorize.
"Senator" Massie is actually a Congressman.
Unfortunately, governance is more of a spectator sport for this Congress.
We have now officially blundered our way into Donald Rumsfeld's mysterious world of "unknown unknowns." Like Dark Energy itself, it's a dimension that can't even be described using existing parameters. We have no idea what will happen now.
With a demented moron desperate to remain the center of attention everywhere at all times, cosplaying somebody tough, competent, stable, and intelligent, no matter the cost or consequences, supposedly running things, but barely in charge of his own faculties and at the mercy of all kinds of 'grey cardinals' whispering God knows what in his ear -- even if he listens --- well, good luck with sleeping soundly tonight!
Two things I most noted from this discussion:
[1] It is a regime that has built proxies, has a terrorist reach across the globe, has the largest missile inventory in the region, started a regional conflict with the help of its proxies on October 7, 2023, and is building a nuclear weapon. I mean, I think that's abundantly clear.
{2] ...will Trump now use even more power to suppress dissent, to crack down on free speech, to deport people, to perhaps suspend or try to suspend habeas corpus. The litany of things that he might try if this becomes an extended war is truly frightful.
In addition to what you all are saying, my concern is that Donnie Two Dolls will cancel the fall elections bc he’s afraid his bootlickers will be voted out of office.
War is truly unpredictable! We’d better prepare ourselves for certain retaliation by Iran, how, when and where is the question?
Sleeper cells already likely in place with contingency plans. While Deadeyes Miller and ICE Barbie are bankrupting DHS hunting down students and grandparents, they’re completely unprepared for a 9/11 redux. Fat Donnie just impulsively kicked a hornet’s nest with the full support of his fascist party (and Fetterman). Israel doesn’t have the capacity for a ground war in Iran, which means guess who for the next step? Only a world-class moron believes that he can punch a modern nation of 95 million in the nose a couple of times and walk away unscathed.
Oh, and he still wants his plutocratic tax cuts and draconian social cuts. Absolute shitshow.
If another 9/11 attack would happen you know that Miller and Vought will have thr E.O. ready to declare a national emergency and take away all rights.
We need to stay in the streets.
There is a Protest Rally planned for June 26th - MoveOn and Public Citizen are sponsoring this one. Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
The next NO KINGS PROTEST RALLY is scheduled for July 4th. Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
There will be a Protest Rally honoring the late great Congressman John Lewis's 5th Anniversary of his death - "Good Trouble" - Please check - https://www.mobilize.us for more infomation.
Thank you...
Thank you for this. I hope the organizers will start putting info re locations of rallies up soon.
Thank you Jen🙏🏻♥️🇺🇸🥺
America has allowed this one man to plunge our nation into war!
Remember, though, that it was not our president but Netanyahu who did this. DJT was played, to the hilt.
Just following in Shrub's footsteps.
Appreciated the rapid conversation with experienced, knowledgeable people. TY
Trump needed this to “change the subject” of his dismal poll numbers. Sick.
This should DEFINITELY make him a national favorite again. /s
Ah, his poll numbers are already in the loo. He is demented and in sane.
No plan survives contact with the enemy. No one really knows what's going to happen now. Brace yourselves for much higher gas prices and a tanking stock market to start with.
This is also the time for mainstream media to be forthright in the their reporting! Must stop the gas lighting and BS!