There’s a new development concerning the Epstein files, namely there is an alleged, ongoing coverup of President Trump’s presence in the files. This morning, Oversight Democrats released more emails from Epstein’s estate that places Trump in a location he swears he’s never even seen.
Representative Maxwell Frost (D-FL) joins Jen to expose what we know—and what is yet to be revealed—about the Epstein files and how it implicates Trump and his administration. Rep. Frost and Jen also discuss Pam Bondi’s degradation of the Justice Department and what the heck is going on with our air traffic controllers. “You literally had Sean Duffy just come out yesterday and say, ‘I can’t guarantee safety.’ Frost says, “well, what’s your job? I mean, your job is to guarantee safety. Your job is to make sure that we’re safe. I mean, it was just insane to hear him say that.”
Maxwell Frost is a junior congressman representing Florida’s 10th district. Frost is a longtime activist and organizer, serving as the national organizing director for March for Our Lives. He also volunteered with Barack Obama, Bernie Sanders, and Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaigns. He currently sits on the Committee on Transportation & Infrastructure & Committee of Oversight and Government Reform.
Transcript has been edited slightly for formatting purposes.
Jen Rubin
Hi, this is Jen Rubin, Editor-in-Chief of the Contrarian. We’re delighted to have with us Representative Maxwell Frost from Florida. Welcome!
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Hey, good to be on, thanks for having me.
Jen Rubin
We woke up this morning and heard news of, some released documents on Epstein. Tell us what’s in them and why it’s so significant, that we’re getting more and more evidence, that, Donald Trump had perhaps a closer relationship with Jeffrey Epstein than he has previously admitted.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Yeah, well, I mean, it is fact, not conjecture, that Jeffrey Epstein and Donald Trump were very close friends. Very close friends. He also had a close relationship with Glenn Maxwell as well, and so anything people say to the contrary is just not true. It’s out there, it’s proven fact, and that’s important to know. Now, of the new documents that we received on the Oversight Committee, there’s 3 specific ones that we released. Or a bombshell. And these are 3 different emails. One of them specifically is from Jeffrey Epstein himself, between him and Ghislaine Maxwell. And Jeffrey Epstein himself is commenting on, kind of, everything going on, and he’s saying that he’s a bit surprised that Donald Trump’s name hasn’t really come up much, or if at all, during the initial investigations and everything being in the press. He says that the reason it surprises him the most is because he spent hours alone with one of the victims. And that alone, I mean, shows that, at a minimum, if you want to be very benevolent, at a minimum. Not only did he… was he aware of what was going on, but he was around it. And then, obviously, on the other end of that, we don’t know what he was doing alone with this teenage girl for hours.
Jen Rubin
Right.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
And and so I think that’s, you know, this is a huge development.
Jen Rubin
Let me just stop you there. The name is obviously redacted to protect the victim. Do you know, as part of the oversight, that this was, in fact, someone who was underage?
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Yeah, it’s one of the victims. I know exactly who it is, we want to protect the… we, you know, we want to make sure that… I understand. Yeah, with the victims, but this is someone who, someone who’s part of this sex trafficking rink, and was underage, yeah. So, so that’s where we’re at right now. Now, this is happening at the same time as today at 4 o’clock, Adelita Gray Hall is gonna get sworn in on the House floor. The first thing she’s gonna do is sign the discharge petition. So Trump right now, the White House is completely making calls to these few Republicans on the discharge petition. He’s personally calling them he’s demanding that they come to the White House, he’s trying to get them to remove their names. And, you know, I’m about to release a video saying this, too, that it’s interesting that this is coming from the people who, during Black Lives Matter, kept saying, well, if you’re not guilty, just comply. Well, Donald, if you’re not guilty, just comply. Why are you pressuring people in your own party to take their names off? Because at 4pm, when Adelita signs her name, that’s it, it’s too late to take your name off. as of this interview, an hour and 45 minutes. As of now, no one’s taken their name off or said they will, but Donald Trump’s doing everything he can. And from this email, directly from Epstein, right? It’s not from some… this is from the guy himself talking about Trump. He even said, something about… he’s surprised that the dog didn’t bark, or something like that. And go… responded saying… agreeing with what he said, so…
Jen Rubin
And this was way before Donald Trump ever got to the White House. This is, kind of in the wake of the sweetheart deal, pardon the expression, that he made, with the U.S. Attorney. So we’re talking years before Donald Trump was thought of as a presidential candidate. Tell us about the other, emails.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
The other emails are, one of them is between Epstein and an author that he’s friends with, and, they’re kind of going back and forth on the whole thing, and this guy’s essentially just giving him advice, also talking about Trump as well. And the part at the end of the email that people should really know about is they talk about what line should we feed Trump. Essentially, if we were able to dictate and tell Trump what he should say, in a perfect world, what would he say? This is Jeffrey Epstein, and someone who is a close confidant of him, talking about, essentially, how to continue a cover-up or how to stay out of trouble. So, these emails are damning, and we’re gonna continue on. Now, the thing I have to tell people is this… Investigation’s gonna continue.
Jen Rubin
Yeah. And I know a lot of people are saying, well, that’s it, we don’t have everything. We have a lot more we need to get, and I’m telling you guys, there’s a lot more there.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
This is stuff coming from the estate that Summer Lee for Garcia were able to subpoena in a different subcommittee months ago charge petition is to get what the DOJ and what the administration has. I think it’s important that we do that. Now, do I think Donald Trump is… his own administration’s gonna hand over documents that implicate him in what’s going on? No, I don’t. I don’t. I think they’re gonna throw every roadblock they can. We’re talking about…Some of the most powerful people in the world that would do anything. To ensure they’re not implicated in this. And so, it’s still important that we move forward with this, but people have to know that this investigation goes far beyond just the documents that DOJ has, but we’re also going to be issuing subpoenas to banks for bank statement, financial institutions, different things like that, so we can get a really good picture of what’s going on. But I want to make sure people know this, because this administration will do everything they can to make sure that they don’t release those files. If they do release the files, I’m not… I don’t have confidence that it’s gonna be everything.
Jen Rubin
And so… And I think that is the concern of many, many Americans. There is this ability…
Rep. Maxwell Frost
There’s a little more we can do, and that’s why I wanted to say this, people shouldn’t give up by thinking, well, are we gonna get everything? Trust me, there’s information in a lot of other places that no one’s dug in before, and one of the big ones are these estate files. That’s how we got the birthday card. That’s how we got these emails, and we also need to go for the financial institutions as well.
Jen Rubin
Now, for Republicans who are thinking of taking their names off that petition, that would seem to be very foolhardy at this point. In the very timely release of these emails, it’s very clear to the American people that this is really a horrific issue. Are you sensing any reluctance on the part of some of those people who have indicated they’re on the petition that they’re gonna back out of this, or are they in at this point?
Rep. Maxwell Frost
We haven’t seen anything yet. We haven’t seen any public reporting yet. I haven’t spoken with any of them. So we don’t know. And you’re 100% right. With this being released, I mean, what kind of look is that?
Jen Rubin
Yes.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Steve, probably the most damning evidence we’ve received thus far. Absolutely. And the same day you remove your name, I’m not sure they’d do that, but I promise you, Trump is doing everything he can. He’s, promising things, he’s threatening things, I mean, everything you can think of. Again, these are people that will do anything. Right. Right? This is the man who, essentially, who incited insurrection on our nation to stay in power. And so I think he’s throwing everything at them, and so we’ll… we’ll see, and hopefully they… they stay on, because for them to get off, it’s not a little thing, right? Yes. Everyone, the whole country’s gonna know. I know they’re weighing both of those things.
Jen Rubin
Now, the Attorney General of the United States, not so long ago, was insisting there’s nothing to see. What is her fate? How can she possibly, plausibly stay in her role? Will there be calls for her to resign? And frankly, will there be any talk of impeachment, if she has been abjectly lying to the American people about what is in there and whether Donald Trump is implicated?
Rep. Maxwell Frost
We’ll see as we continue. I mean, yeah, I mean, Pam Bondi is a lapdog crony sycophant for Trump, and that’s what she was hired to do. I always tell people to… I was always telling people during the election, as he puts together his team, he’s not looking for a team to win an election, he’s looking for a team to steal an election. He’s looking for a team to… that will do whatever he says, and that’s the biggest lesson that Donald Trump learned from last term. That we have to understand is the most… this is why he’s more effective for evil this term. Because last time, he allowed himself to be surrounded and put people in positions of power that… were with him on neo-fascism and everything, but weren’t necessarily loyal to him like you’re loyal to a king. And so, some of them, at even some points, pumped the brakes on stuff, and he couldn’t fully trust them. He wasn’t gonna make that mistake again. That’s why the first name he put forward was Matt Gaetz. You know, I mean, he was like, you know, that’s my guy. And then he went for Pam Bondi, who…I know a lot about was our Attorney General in Florida, did horrible things there, going after working people especially. Then she left and went to become a top-tier lobbyist and, you know, continued to sell her soul for millions and millions of dollars. And I promise you that when she was talking with Trump about becoming the Attorney General for the country, there was a pact or oath made privately, that she would do everything she can to defend Trump. That’s why she’s really not the Attorney General, the people are of the country. She’s Trump’s personal lawyer, and she And she happens to be the Attorney General. She’s 100% part of this huge cover-up, and we will seek accountability on that as well.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely. Let me switch gears from your role on the Oversight Committee to your role on the Transportation Committee, and you really are, it seems, in the center of, all the big issues these days. Yeah. It has become very evident that our air traffic system is a mess. We’ve lost people, this administration was threatening people, this administration has laid people off. How concerned are you about the state of the air traffic, system, and, what can Congress, or what should Congress be doing about it?
Rep. Maxwell Frost
A few things. Number one, for a long time, the system’s been out of date and it has needed modernization. For a long time, our air traffic controllers have been severely understaffed, but what… it’s hitting critical levels, while at the same time, we have an incompetent administration and an idiot in Sean Duffy who just does not know what he’s doing. I mean, the guy literally does not know how to run DOT, he doesn’t understand the day-to-day. what’s going on. So you have, kind of, this issue that’s been prevalent for a long time coming to, you know, headbutting with the fact that this guy doesn’t know what he’s doing, and it’s even worse. And for people to know, our air traffic controller, their staffing levels have been low this entire year, and then Doge came in fired people and did all this, and then, of course, the shutdown on top of that, with Trump shutting down the government so that way he could raise healthcare costs on people, made it even worse. You know, our air traffic system right now is… is… we’re not in a good place. And what it requires is really funds and modernization, and making sure that we can hire more people to do the job. But a lot of people don’t know this, air traffic controllers are federal employees across the entire nation. It’s not a different entity, airport to airport. These are federal employees that are hired. And believe it or not, when you have an administration that comes in that says part of their ethos is to quote-unquote, traumatize the federal workforce, you’re not gonna get a lot of people that are super jazzed to do a high-stress job, like air traffic controlling. Especially when, for people who don’t know, it’s a rigorous process that you have to go through, and so I think all these things combined are why we’re in this situation, and unfortunately, I don’t see a way out in the near future, because these people are just so incompetent. You just don’t know what’s doing. And I’m talking about the administration. Our air traffic controllers are great. They’re doing what they can with what they have, you know?
Jen Rubin
Well, it would seem that your Republican colleagues should have an interest. They get on airplanes as well. Their family members and constituents fly too, so perhaps.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
They can be…You know, you’d think that, and I thought, you know, as, you know, I thought… I mean, when they’d experience gun violence, maybe we’d get gun violence prevention legislation, and Steve Scalise was literally shot close here to the Capitol, and they continue their same tune on stuff. So even if they’re… them themselves are implicated or hurt because of census gun violence or what’s going on with air traffic controlling, they’re dug in, it looks like, on the incompetence and putting our people at risk. I mean, you literally had Sean Duffy just come out yesterday and say, I can’t guarantee safety. well, what’s your job? I mean, your job is to guarantee safety. Your job is to make sure that we’re safe. I mean, it was just insane to hear him say that. I continue… I don’t know why I continue to be surprised, but…
Jen Rubin
Yeah, I know. You’re in company there.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Yeah, yeah.
Jen Rubin
I keep thinking people who take these jobs operate in good faith, and why would you take this job if you weren’t dedicated to serving the American people? We have learned otherwise. Last topic that I want to hit, which is perhaps the most important, and is obviously on people’s minds, and that is, the ACA premiums are going to skyrocket. I don’t know the precise numbers for your constituents, and for Texas, but these are traumatic increases. Are Republicans just content to allow people to be priced out of, health insurance? Is there any reason to believe that they’re gonna realize we are in a crisis and come to the table to try to deal with it?
Rep. Maxwell Frost
That’s the sad part, Jen. I think a lot of them do know we’re in a crisis. I think a lot of them are feeling heat, but they’re scared of Donald… they’re more scared of Donald Trump than they are of their own constituents, and so they’re making the determination that I just need to, like, do what Trump says. In Florida, we, you know, we have the largest Affordable Care Act marketplace in the country. 1.9 million people. My district is the 7th largest Affordable Care Act district in the country. So, 189,000 people in my district alone have their healthcare costs going up. And, people ask me why, like. Why would they do this? It’s gonna hurt Republicans too, it hurts everyone. And the answer’s very simple. They gave permanent tax cuts in the big, beautiful bill to billionaires and megacorporations. tax giveaways cost our nation money, because it’s less revenue that we’re coming in to make sure that we can have a fire department in our schools and the air traffic controllers and everything that we do. And so what they have to do is they have to make sure that we up the revenue a little bit, and instead of having the billionaires and corporations do that, because that’s who Donald Trump fights for, and that’s what he is. He wants working people to do it. So he wants you to pay more for your healthcare.
So that way, billionaires can pay less. That’s… that is literally what’s going on, there’s nothing else. That is what’s going on. It’s been the same thing over and over and over again. People know this story, it’s the same tired story, the rich get richer, the poor get poorer. I mean, it’s the same thing people are used to, it’s just on such a massive scale, and it’s right in front of your face. And it don’t matter if you’re a Democrat or a Republican or whatever. It’s gonna impact you.
Jen Rubin
Well, I think it’s pretty clear where the Republicans stand at this point. I think it’s pretty clear where the Democrats stand, so we’re going to see if they really have the nerve to go through with this. Thank you so much, Congressman, for all you’re doing in all three of these issues, and for coming to chat with us. We will absolutely have you back as we follow all three of these stories, so thank you very much. We’ll see you soon.
Rep. Maxwell Frost
Thanks for having me on.
